Space & Astronomy/Space and Astronomy (October 1993).iso/pc/text/spacedig/v12_5/v12_587.txt

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Subject: SPACE Digest V12 #587

SPACE Digest                                     Volume 12 : Issue 587

Today's Topics:
            Re: Magellan Update - 11/16/90
              Star gazer..maybe
              Re: Photon engine
              Re: Photon Engine
             Re: Congrats to Ted Molczan
           Pioneer Venus Update - 11/16/90
           Re: Big bang discovered 1400 years ago ?
             space news from Oct 1 AW&ST
             Re: The Space Plane
               Re: New Shuttle Engines
            Re: HST/Saturn article
             Re: The Space Plane

Administrivia:

    Submissions to the SPACE Digest/sci.space should be mailed to
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----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 19 Nov 90 17:01:41 GMT
From: att!linac!pacific.mps.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!uflorida!rex!rouge![e-mail]  (Fraering Philip)
Subject: Re: Magellan Update - 11/16/90

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Eric C. Bennett) writes:

ecb>I guess this may be considered a 'dumb' question, but, what is the mission
ecb>objective (other than the obvious, i.e. mapping Venus) of the Magellan
ecb>spacecraft. In other words, what does the science community hope to learn
ecb>by mapping Venus?

Comparative geology between Earth, Venus and Mars. And, hopefully, possibly
answering questions where climate and geology are interrelated, like the
'goldilocks effect' where Venus is too hot, Mars is too cold, and the
Earth is just right.

This is probrably the most important question in solar system
geology today. I better stop now before I say anymore broad generalizations.

Phil Fraering
[e-mail]
"The huns were imposing on horseback, but who isn't?" - Will Cuppy, _The
Decline and Fall of Practically Everybody_.

------------------------------

Date: 21 Nov 90 06:34:40 GMT
From: bacchus.pa.dec.com!shodha.enet.dec.com!levers.enet.dec.com![e-mail]  (Bob Egan)
Subject: Star gazer..maybe


MY 8 year old daughter has really been after to me to help her "look
at the stars and the moon and "pluto" ..etc.. I am sure you get the picture.

Please help a fellow Engineer/Daddy !

I know virtually nothing about finding constellations/planets etc...
I looking for a program for my pc..or of course a vax :)..that will
with some projections of the sky..which  outlines the constellations/
planet locations which "we" can use with a telescope I plan to get her
xmas...

This seems to be a real "interest" for her as she as mentioned it
many times since last spring...and now with her library card, she brings
a star book for her and Daddy to read....

Any  info on a reasonable telescope/with clock ...so we can at least
see some detail on the moon would be appreciated...GREATLY.

Thanks all and have a nice thanksgiving,
Bob

                -------------------------------------------



Bob Egan    [e-mail]
        --or-- ...!decwrl!levers.enet.dec.com!b_egan
        --or-- [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 21 Nov 90 10:55:03 GMT
From: att!linac!tellab5!laidbak!obdient!vpnet![e-mail]  (*Greg*)
Subject: Re: Photon engine


Just think!  You can even heat up the chicken soup for dinner!
:-)

I like the Photon engine.

Somehow, some shmoe will figger a way to make a photonic engine faster than
the mass engine.  And leave one in his wake.

------------------------------

Date: 20 Nov 90 19:09:12 GMT
From: vsi1!hsv3![e-mail]  (Mike Van Pelt)
Subject: Re: Photon Engine

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Brian or James) writes:
>I may be misremembering, but I don't think the lasers are intended
>for use in a 'pure' photon engine. Photon engines have to have very impressive
>power supplies to generate large values of thrust (Power = C x Force, or
>something? My mind is going...). My impression was that they use the land
>based laser to evaporate reaction mass, with the benefits of not having to
>carry the powerplant to orbit, and being able to achieve higher exhaust
>velocities.

That's close to how the laser-launcher Dr. Arthur Kantrowitz (sp?)
designed would work.  Actually (trying to remember the details of a
talk Dr. Kantrowitz gave to the Silicon Valley L-5 Society several
years ago) the principal that gives the laser launcher its thrust is
that when a laser beam with a power density of greater than 2 megawatts
per square centimeter hits a surface -- ANY surface, even the best
possible mirror -- in the presence of an gas, you get a laser-
propogated detonation wave from the surface back down the path of the
laser beam.  At this point, you should turn the laser off, or it would
be bad. :-)

In the version Dr. Kantrowitz described to us, you'd have a pulsed CO2
laser focused on a sintered metal plate wetted with liquid argon.  The
main function of the argon is to provide an atmosphere in the engine to
support the detonation wave.  The cute feature of the laser is that it
would send out dual pulses -- a low-power "leader" pulse would excite
the water vapor and CO2 in the atmosphere to a higher energy state
where they're transparent to infrared, then the full power pulse would
travel down this column of "bleached" air.
--
Mike Van Pelt   Headland Technology/Video 7    ...ames!vsi1!v7fs1!mvp
The electronic networks,  of course, have always been the terrorist's
most reliable ally, for they have never failed to bend over backwards
to give him what he craves: extravagant publicity.  --  Petr Beckmann

------------------------------

Date: 20 Nov 90 21:02:32 GMT
From: sdd.hp.com!usc!isi.edu!wlf.isi.edu![e-mail]  (Craig Milo Rogers)
Subject: Re: Congrats to Ted Molczan

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Charlie Thompson) writes:
>I picked up a copy of the Washington Post today and noticed
>that fellow satellite chaser Ted Molczan made the 'Around the Nation'
...

    I noticed a similar article in the Los Angeles Times.  It was
attributed to United Press International.  Do you suppose UPI treats
the Usenet as an incoming newsfeed?

                    Craig Milo Rogers

------------------------------

Date: 21 Nov 90 00:57:46 GMT
From: snorkelwacker.mit.edu!usc!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!jato!mars.jpl.nasa.gov![e-mail]  (Ron Baalke)
Subject: Pioneer Venus Update - 11/16/90


                   PIONEER VENUS STATUS REPORT
                       November 16, 1990

     Superior Conjunction concluded on November 15.  The science
complement for power sharing plan T1 will be commanded on, the
bit rate will be returned to 256 bps, and the spacecraft will be
commanded to coherent mode.  A precession maneuver and HGA (High
Gain Antenna) adjustment has been scheduled for November 19, to
be executed as close to Apoapsis as possible.
      ___    _____     ___
     /_ /|  /____/ \  /_ /|
     | | | |  __ \ /| | | |      Ron Baalke         | [e-mail]
  ___| | | | |__) |/  | | |___   Jet Propulsion Lab | [e-mail]
 /___| | | |  ___/    | |/__ /|  M/S 301-355        |
 |_____|/  |_|/       |_____|/   Pasadena, CA 91109 |

------------------------------

Date: 19 Nov 90 13:02:51 GMT
From: rayssd![e-mail]  (Paul L. White)
Subject: Re: Big bang discovered 1400 years ago ?


Your article on the koran and the Big Bang was extremely enlightening.
Tell me more about the koran, please...especially the enlightening part
about clitorectomies in the Moslem culture.

Did Cat Stevens really get one?

===========================================================================
Paul White
plw@rayssdb                   Safety in numbness
===========================================================================

------------------------------

Date: 22 Nov 90 05:22:19 GMT
From: van-bc!ubc-cs!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!utgpu!utzoo![e-mail]  (Henry Spencer)
Subject: space news from Oct 1 AW&ST

An orbiter lifting facility is being set up at the shuttle-orbiter production
and maintenance facility in Palmdale so that orbiters can be flown directly
there by 747, rather than being unloaded at Edwards and moved to Palmdale
by road.  The lifting hardware is the set that used to be at Vandenberg.

Radarsat International Inc signs with Spot Image to do Canadian distribution
of Spot images.  The company is also distributing Landsat data and plans to
market radar images once Radarsat is finally aloft in 1994.

Columbia to roll out to pad 39B for a tanking test after Ulysses goes up.
The source of the latest hydrogen leak has not yet been pinned down, but
it should be possible to find, fix, and test it in time for a December launch.

NASA will consider redesigning the Incredible Shrinking Space Station yet
again if Congress cuts the $2.45G request, which is almost certain.  [Yup.]

Large set of articles on what little is known and speculated about secret
US experimental aircraft, some of them possibly hypersonic.

SEP gears up for the first full-thrust tests of the Vulcain oxyhydrogen
engine for Ariane 5, scheduled to start late this year.  So far, things
are on track.  The only design change so far is reinforcing rings on the
lower half of the nozzle, after a nozzle collapsed (due to flow separation
of the exhaust jet from the nozzle wall during startup) during early tests.
Vulcain is described as a simple engine using a classic design, aimed at
low cost rather than maximum performance.

Pioneer 10 reaches a distance of 50AU from the Sun, still reporting useful
data on the Sun's atmosphere.  It was Pioneer 10 that first established
that said atmosphere extends far out beyond the edges of the solar system,
rather than ending around the orbit of Jupiter as once suspected.  P10 will
be in communication with Earth until about the year 2000 (and about 75AU)
if all goes well.

Feature article on Ulysses.  The IUS/PAM combination of upper stages is
the heftiest yet used, and will push Ulysses to an Earth-relative velocity
of 15.4 km/s, the highest ever attained.  In early 1992, Ulysses will do
a Jupiter flyby throwing it southward out of the ecliptic.  It will then
fly over the south pole of the Sun June 1994, continuing around to pass
over the north pole a year later.  Work started in 1978, and was repeatedly
delayed by eight launch-vehicle changes and by the US withdrawal in 1984
from what was originally a two-spacecraft mission.  ESA named it Ulysses
in 1988, for more than one reason.

Despite the heavy launcher, Ulysses is actually one of the smaller
spacecraft launched by the shuttle.  One of the losses when the US dumped
the original mission was imaging capability, so this is strictly a fields-
and-particles mission.

Discovery will run several other experiments after sending Ulysses on its
way, including exposure tests of materials like those on the stranded
Intelsat (to determine whether it will be worth rescuing) and a set of
burns of opposing nose thrusters during reentry (to determine whether it
is practical to burn off unused fuel from the nose thruster system at
that time, for improved safety and better center-of-gravity control).

NASA's "Comet" program, which calls for a new medium booster with a
recoverable unmanned spacecraft, has produced some interesting bidders.
Orbital Sciences will propose a version of Taurus (which is a wingless
Pegasus on top of an MX first stage).  Space Services Inc, risen from
the dead :-), will propose one of its innumerable Conestoga variants.
E-Prime will bid "a version of an existing US ballistic missile".  The
most interesting bids are from Amroc and... Israel.  Amroc will bid the
Aurora, built by a team of US companies with Amroc supplying only the
engines, since Amroc withdrew from trying to supply complete launchers
after its pad fire last year.  (The other companies involved have not
been identified.)  Finally, Israel Aircraft Industries, teamed with Delta
Research of Huntsville, is offering its Shavit booster.  IAI faces some
problems, like a requirement for 51% US ownership of the bid, and like
US bureaucratic stupidity about the Missile Technology Control Act, which
bans transfer of US technology that might improve foreign missile systems.
(IAI says it is "ridiculous" to apply the MTCA to Shavit, when the US is
openly and officially assisting Israeli missile development, namely the
Arrow anti-tactical-ballistic-missile project.)

The Comet program calls for carrying a 300lb payload up and bringing it
back down, plus providing it with another 150lb of support hardware that
remains in orbit.  First launch could be as early as 1992, with the
initial contract calling for one launch a year for three years and an
option for two more.

Third Titan IV launch slips, it's not clear how much, due to a leak in
the SRB thrust-vectoring system.  Discovery/Ulysses now gets range
priority at the Cape.  The USAF claims that the Titan IV schedule will
not be significantly affected.
--
"I don't *want* to be normal!"         | Henry Spencer at U of Toronto Zoology
"Not to worry."                        |  [e-mail]   utzoo!henry

------------------------------

Date: 20 Nov 90 19:49:05 GMT
From: ndsuvm1![e-mail]
Subject: Re: The Space Plane

Just read the NASP conversation that's been brewing, and have my own 2: worth..

X-30 = NASP (That much is clear); DARPA project, not NASA
X-29 = Forward-swept test platform built by Grumman (NORTHROP built the F-5;
       sorry, guys) as a technology demonstrator (2 are currently flying)

Commercial Variant?  I doubt it.  Establishing speeds around M20 just to go to
Tokyo?  Big time waste.  There may eventually be a commercial version of the
NASP, once Freedom starts allowing tourists.  Otherwise, there's really no
justifying the cost involved.

Purpose?  To show we can do it.  As the X-series designation shows, this is
purely a test vehicle.  After that, it is envisioned (idea stage only, as far
as I know) that the NASP could be used to supplement STS or Shuttle-C or other
heavy lift/dumb lifters that may be in place.  To the best of my knoweledge, it
is not meant to be a Shuttle replacement.

Back in September of 1988, the University of North Dakota Department of Space
Studies held an international conference on Hypersonic Flight.  If anyone is
interested in information about that (there are rumors that another will be
upcoming, although probably not in ND) or was in attendance, please contact me
through e-mail.  Topics included overviews of foreign projects (HOTOL, HERMES,
SANGER, etc), propulsion considerations, environmental impacts, legal concerns,
etc.

Any other questions/comments are welcome.

Mark Olson
UD135831@NDSUVM1  (University of North Dakota)
1007 22nd Ave S.
Grand Forks, ND  58201
[phone]

------------------------------

Date: 19 Nov 90 22:41:03 GMT
From: usc!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!src.honeywell.com!msi.umn.edu!cs.umn.edu!kksys!wd0gol!newave![e-mail]  (John A. Weeks III)
Subject: Re: New Shuttle Engines

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail]:
> In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Greg Cronau):
> > I can understand why reviving the Saturn program would be damn near
> > impossible, but what problems were encountered with reviving just the
> > F-1 engine program?

> 2) F-1 production test facilities were located in the San Fernando valley
> (turbopumps at Rocketdyne/Santa Susana) and Edwards AFB (full-up engine
> tests). These facilities are way past the inactive stage - they have been
> either torn down or become completely derelict.

On a related note, I recently toured the NASA Stines Center in Mississippi
where NASA tests & certifies the shuttle engines.  The buildings that
housed the test facilities for the Saturn engines are still there, but
they have long since been converted for other uses.  The second stage
test building now houses a rather deep water tank that is used to test
sensors used in ocean research.  The only thing that appears to be left
from Saturn and Apollo are some blast staines on the concrete.

-john-

--
===============================================================================
John A. Weeks III               [phone]               [e-mail]
NeWave Communications                ...uunet!rosevax!bungia!wd0gol!newave!john
===============================================================================

------------------------------

Date: 21 Nov 90 22:15:56 GMT
From: uflorida!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!jarthur![e-mail]  (Stat Mech Loves Me)
Subject: Re: HST/Saturn article

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Ron Baalke) writes:
.>Photos of Saturn show huge storm
.>
.>"The Hubble Space Telescope has returned pictures of a
.>remarkable event on Saturn, a storm that has grown from an
.>Earth-sized white dot to a girdle around the planet with
.>ammonia clouds billowing 150 miles high."

Great!  Now thw next question is when and where will these images be made
available by FTP??  Anyone know?

-David L. Williamson
Harvey Mudd College

------------------------------

Date: 19 Nov 90 23:54:31 GMT
From: solo!cs.utexas.edu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!utgpu!utzoo![e-mail]  (Henry Spencer)
Subject: Re: The Space Plane

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>I'm fairly certain NASP is a commercial venture. What I'm not sure of
>is, is NASP the same as the X-29? Maybe the X-29 is the military vehicle
>you're talking about.

NASP is the X-30.  The X-29 is a (pair of) forward-swept-wing research
aircraft unrelated to this discussion.  NASP is "commercial" in about the
same sense that the SR-71 was commercial, i.e. commercial contractors are
slurping up lots of government money working on how to build it.
--
"I don't *want* to be normal!"         | Henry Spencer at U of Toronto Zoology
"Not to worry."                        |  [e-mail]   utzoo!henry

------------------------------

End of SPACE Digest V12 #587
*******************